Jim,

The reason that Christ came into the world and was Crucified on the Cross was so that mankind could avoid going to Hell when they pass away. That is why individuals receive Christ as their Savior because they recognize that they are sinners and are going to Hell and they wish to avoid going to Hell when they pass away and thus they receive Christ as their Savior in order to go to Heaven when they pass away. That is the whole basis of Christianity.

jgb321,

I do not tell anybody in person that they have to receive Christ as their Savior in order to be saved because I am not that comfortable engaging in interpersonal communication face to face with individuals. I only tell individuals that they have to receive Christ as their Savior in order to be saved on discussion forums.

Robert

When I was 15, and just left school I worked for British Railways. This was in the steam train days.

When the queen was going to use the royal carriages the engine which was to pull them was sent away for an overhaul and came back looking as if it was new. A spare engine was treated the same in case the first broke down. They were both cleaned specially on the due day. Also the small engine which pulled the carriages from the sheds had days of cleaning, including steam cleaning of the rods etc. It also had the paint touched up. The company did the best they could for her majesty.

When we worship God, we are not just honouring a king, but the king of all kings, and only our best is good enough.

You have said ou are uncomfortable speaking to people. and also that you can't be bothered to get up on The Lord's Day. Remember that a King died in your place.

Was beaten and died the most painful death.

Davo,

The Saturday Vigil Mass is considered to be worship on the Lord's Day because it is exactly like Sunday Morning Mass because it has the exact same readings from the Bible as Sunday Morning Mass does. I never stated that I never go to Sunday Morning Mass. I go to Sunday Morning Mass on Easter Sunday because the Easter Vigil Mass is 2 hours in duration. I also go to Sunday Morning Mass when I am busy on Saturday. When I only participate in the scriptural parts to the Mass then I am worshipping Christ in a scriptural manner because the scriptural parts to the Mass are scriptural.

But even if a Catholic, Eastern Orthodox or a Mainline Protestant who has received Christ as their Savior does not leave the Catholic Church, Eastern Orthodox Church or Mainline Protestant Church and join a Fundamentalist or Evangelical Church they will still go to Heaven when they pass away because church membership has no bearing on salvation and gaining entrance into Heaven.

What difference does it make if someone who has received Christ as their Savior informs other individuals that they need to receive Christ as their Savior in order to get saved and gain entrance into Heaven by either informing them by interpersonal communication or by informing them on discussion forums?

Mr Mazar,

If you truly believe what you have stated here, then let me please respond in kind:

First, The reason Christ came into the this world is because He loves us, and is going to receive all the glory, honor, and praises for His sacrifice from those for whom He died. Not because so everyone could "avoid" going to hell. It sounds like man made a wrong turn and just needs to steer back on course or something to get to heaven with this statement.

Second, Any individual that simply tries to gain salvation because he is afraid his flesh is about to be singed, better take another look at the truth of salvation, because he probably isn't saved. Salvation comes only from the urging of the Holy Spirit(John 6:44), and when the Holy Spirit reveals to that person the enormity of his guilt and how blameful he is before God, then he falls flat on his face in repentence, not because he's afraid of going to hell.


Jim

Well said Jim

We once had a pastor who siad we became christians because we wanted to go to heaven.

We do not.

We become christians because we realize we have offended and sinner against a holy God who cannot abide sin, and because we have repented of our sin and turned to Christ for forgiveness.

The difference as I see it is like two children who have doen wrong and upset their mum.

The first says sorry as he does not want to get punished, but goes and does the same thing later.

The second says sorry in tears because he realizes that he has upset his mum and resolves not to do it again

This post was last modified: Fri Feb 17, 2006 09:26 AM by Davo.

Jim and Davo,

The reason that Christ had to become human and be Crucified and Resurrected was so that mankind could have a relationship with God again and to save mankind from Hell. Ones eternal salvation and going to Heaven after passing away is what it is all about. I had known for about 17 years prior to receiving Christ as my Personal Savior that receiving Christ as Personal Savior was required in order to get saved and go to Heaven after passing away but I was not paying attention to the urging of the Holy Spirit to receive Christ as Personal Savior. But in November of 1999 at my brother's Non Denominational Church they had a Wild Game Feed where they had Bear, Bison, Deer and Moose and after the meal they had a speaker speaking about hunting and then they had an Altar Call where they invited everybody to receive Christ as Personal Savior and it was during the Altar Call that I decided it was time to pay attention to the urging of the Holy Spirit to receive Christ as Personal Savior.

Robert I will not criticize nor judge whether or not you are saved. What I will judge, and have the right to judge, is truth when it is spoken.

You are completely entitled to serve yourself after salvation. Free-will, nope, because you are placing yourself back under the bondage of flesh from which you were freed in the first place. Repentance today is so very different from the New Testament church. I would like to see christians repent on God's terms again.

There are so many self-proclaiming christians out there that say, "Lord I know I am saved but, I can't give myself to you completely, I still have a lot of things I want to do for myself. They are perfectly content to live for themselves after salvation and never come to know the fulness of Christ.

This is the very subject I struggled with all of my life until I realized that this world had absolutely nothing to do with me, or what I wanted to do, but everything to do with Christ.

As it was well-said, "Did God intend to make man happy? Yes, but as a by-product, and not a prime product."

You will never get the happiness you need until you get sold-out to Christ, who by the way, purchased you with His blood. Don't ever forget that. There is no way we could ever repay Him for what He did for us, but He at least deserves the reward for His suffering on that cross. That reward is our salvation and obedience and glorification to Him exclusively.

So sure, you are entitled to live this life for yourself, only you and the Lord are going to know the ramifications for that.

Love in Christ,

Jim

Acts 2: 37 ¶ Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, (That's us) even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

The trouble today is many preachers don't preach repentance. They may mention it in passing, but don't preach it.

The bible doesn't ask us to respond to an altar call, or to accept Christ. God issues a command, Acts 17: 30 says now commandeth all men every where to repent: and to believe, John 3: 16

Davo,

How else is someone supposed to be cleansed by Christ's blood unless they receive Christ as their Personal Savior? All Fundamentalist and Evangelical ministers that I have heard preach about what is required to get saved have stated that the only requirement there is to get saved is to receive Christ as Personal Savior. And Altar Calls or as they used to be called Revival Meetings are the way to get individuals to publicly receive Christ as their Savior.

By repentance unto salvation, just like he said.

Oh, and by the way, just how many "Fundamentalist" and "Evangelicals" have you heard whilst being a catholic?

And you cannot judge the Word by it's preachers, you have to Judge the Word by the Word.

Jim,

Repent means to pray to Christ and ask Him to come into heart to be cleansed of all sins by receiving Him as Personal Savior. I have heard Fundamentalist and Evangelical ministers on television and I have been to a Baptist Church for a funeral and heard the Baptist minister preach about salvation and I have been to my brother's Non Denominational Church several times for Wild Game Feeds, Christmas Concerts and school programs for my Nephew and Niece and at every one of those gatherings at my brother's Non Denominational Church the preaching about how to get saved was brought up. My brother is a better and truer Christian then any of you guys on this forum because he recognizes that the Catholic Church is a True Christian Church because the Catholic Church believes that Christ is God and in the Holy Trinity. My brother is also a better and truer Christian then any of you guys on this forum because he does not preach hatred toward any church that believes that Christ is God and in the Holy Trinity.

Robert

I have not seen any hatred on this board.

It is not hate to warn people of danger, and Robert you are in grave danger, It is not love to tell people lies. It is love to warn people of danger.

The old testament puts it like this: Take note.

And if that wasn't plain, God repeats the message.

Your brother is also in great danger if he teaches what you say he does.

Sorry, I posted this on the wrong thread. It should have been on the Laura Bush Thread in answer to robert's comment about fundamentalist's hatred.

This post was last modified: Sat Feb 18, 2006 02:57 PM by Davo.

Bobby,

Why in the world would you wish to be associated with a pagan church that evolved in the 3rd century AD, has killed more people that both World Wars combined, and still has 125 curses on anybody who disagrees with their theology?

People on this forum will disagree with one another all the time (just read any of my threads) but when you accuse people of hatred, then I think you need to take a closer look at what your church thinks about others (read Council of Trent.)

James