The moderators were not very professional and it was clear that they "had it in" for him. But his answer to the smarmy Carl Cameron was perfect. After I heard his answer, I was glad they asked him. I read somewhere that they had cut that answer from the re-airing of the debate. I don't know if thats true or not because I don't have cable to watch it. I watched it online.
FoxNews has a definite agenda, and it does not include Ron Paul. Sadly most Americans are content to let the media pick their President.
Since I brought it up, I'll post the clip I was referring to above.
It appears that Norma McCorvey, the Woman who was Jane Roe of the Roe v. Wade Supreme Court decision and is now an anti abortion activist, might endorse Ron Paul tomorrow at a press conference in Washington that Ron Paul and herself are holding. Tomorrow is the 35th anniversary of Roe v. Wade and there is a march for life taking place.
Amen, Ray!
You're 110% correct - most Americans (and most fundamental Baptists!) are content to let the news mafia tell them who to vote for. Pretty sad, really. But, I know The Lord is in control, and I'll do everything I can to see Bro Paul elected. The rest of "the pack" are a bunch of "go-along to get-along" punks. If enough Christians wake up soon enough, get on their knees before God, and pay attention to what's going on in the US, we might just pull this out! PRAY!
A government that is large enough to supply everything you need is large enough to take everything you have - Thomas Jefferson
While Ron Paul's personal testimony is compelling, and his record is notable, the attraction to him by some really unsavory groups is disturbing. I would like for him to publicly and forcefully denounce these groups and their beliefs. He also should reject any money that comes from them.
In the Service of the KING,
Brother Tim Keyes (Proverbs 3:5-6)
When I fully rely upon God, I find that He is fully reliable.
It is a good thing to take an interest in who our leaders will be and even to vote but it is also good to remember that God appoints the govt. John 19 v 11 and Romans 13 v 1.
Guys,
Sadly, and to our shame, it has been an extremely long time since we've had the opportunity to put someone in office that has Bro Paul's testimony, character, integrity, and record. We may not get another one. Some of the folks that have sent money in to his campaign, have not been the most savory or desirable, however; the finance guy on his campaign said that Dr Paul denounces certain of these people, but will use the money. I can't hardly fault him for that. Remember, that ALL of the others (Dem or Repub) have gotten donations from people that they didn't agree with, but also, never returned the funds. I don't think there's any candidate that we all agree with 100%. Here's a short article that really captures the spirit of the current campaign:
"Ron Paul supporters this year should take some advice that Eugene V. Debs gave his supporters almost one hundred years ago.
That might sound strange since the differences between the two men are much more obvious than the similarities.
Gene Debs was a railroad worker and union leader,Ron Paul is an obstetrician and a Congressman.
Gene Debs was a Socialist, Ron Paul is a conservative libertarian.
Gene Debs is dead, and Ron Paul is fortunately still with us.
Both men ran for President, Gene Debs in 1900, 1904, 1908, 1912 and 1920 as a Socialist, and Ron Paul in 1988 as a Libertarian and this year as a Republican. Given the difference in their politics that doesn't make them soul mates.
Gene Debs ran with the intention of bringing a basic change to American society. He was in a minority in his thinking, and the society as well as the government were opposed to him. He preached against imperialism in a country enjoying immensely its first experience as an empire. He preached in favor of a strong central government in a time when states' rights were at their strongest. He preached for the working class when capitalism was in its hey day. And he preached peace in a time of war. It was no surprise that he was never elected. His last presidential campaign was run when he was in the federal prison in Atlanta for opposing the draft. And yet, for better and for worse, much of what he fought for eventually became a part of the fabric of American political and social thought.
Ron Paul is running this year, as he did in 1988, with the intention of bringing about a basic change in American society. He is talking about being less aggressive in our foreign policy to a government which is actively seeking to attack new adversaries. He is talking about smaller government and states' rights to a country which feels uncomfortable about any thing which is not regulated by the federal government. He is talking about self reliance and freedom to a society in which victimhood is a desireable role and people look to the government to decide what and how much they eat. He is talking about freedom to a society which is fleeing from the need to make a choice.
In his most strenuous campaign for the presidency, in 1912, Debs regularly said two things to his supporters:
"It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it."
"If I could take you by the hand and lead you into the promised land, I would not do it. If I could take you by the hand and lead you into the promised land today, someone else could take you by the hand tomorrow and lead you back out."
These are things people who are in favor of changing the society should keep in mind during this campaign and after it. Follow and support Ron Paul as far as he can go this year, whether that is the White House or the Republican convention. Don't change to supporting someone who isn't what we want, but can win.
For now and for the future remember that you are seeking and working for change, not for an individual leader. A leader cannot do it for you. For the future it is important to work to bring about the changed and a better society. If you cannot find a candidate you want, run yourself. If you cannot do that, recruit someone to run who can. Remaking an era is not a job for one man or for one year."
Bro Tim, this article is from another Bible-believing Pastor:
(The following article by Marty Tate, which was also submitted to the January 2008 Conservative Standard has been used by permission. Marty is a home-schooling father of seven, business owner, and pastor of Peaceful Valley Baptist Church in Rising Fawn, Georgia.)
Ok…let’s talk about the election. Take note: I want to give you some hard facts. This is NOT some impartial candidate comparison. I fully intend on telling you who I plan to vote for and who I DON’T plan to vote for and why!
Some may not like this, but I believe that as Christians we can dispense with the entire Democratic line-up immediately. The rest won’t like this: I believe that we can dispense with 99.9% of the Republican line-up as well.
Giuliani, McCain, & Romney are all Big Government, tax-and-spend, liberals in conservative’s clothes.
I really want to concentrate on two Republican candidates: Mike Huckabee and Ron Paul.
Let me briefly give you some historical perspective.
If you have followed my columns over the past year, you know that without the influence of the Baptists, religious liberty as we know it would not be the reality that it is in America. Baptists had suffered under various Catholic and Protestant church/state arrangements for over 1700 years all over the world. In the First Amendment, church and state were finally divorced at the Federal level. There were some states that retained an established denomination after the ratification of the Bill of Rights, as the First Amendment only prohibits Congress from passing laws establishing religion, not states.
During the election of 1800, the “Religious Right” of that day (the established Congregationalist denomination in New England) vilified Thomas Jefferson as an infidel. The rhetoric was such that, New England housewives were seen hiding family Bibles after Jefferson’s election because they were convinced that Bibles would soon be confiscated! Baptists however supported Jefferson because they knew that he was a friend of religious liberty. Jefferson shared with the Baptists a belief in liberty of conscience for everyone, and that churches and denominations ought to be able to support themselves without levying taxes on people who did not attend their churches nor agree with their doctrines. It is from correspondence exchanged between the Baptists of Danbury Connecticut and President Jefferson that the phrase “wall of separation between church and state” was drawn.
Here is the point: Thomas Jefferson was not a Bible-believing Christian. He was, most likely a deist. But the Baptists of 1800 did not look for a Presidential candidate who could subscribe to their church’s doctrinal statement. They looked for a man who would follow the Constitution. In our Republic, the Constitution is the higher power. The Constitution puts strict limits on the Federal Government, and erects checks and balances so that no one man or party wields absolute power. That doesn’t mean that morality or religious views don’t matter. I certainly prefer to vote for a Christian, but it really doesn’t matter if a man holds all the correct theological views, if he does not govern by the Constitution. The end result will be the same as if I had voted for a candidate who was a rank unbeliever!
It is astounding today to see the lengths Christians will go to support a candidate who merely mouths all the right religious terminology! It is also astounding to see the amount of control that Christians are willing to hand over to the Federal government in the name of “protecting marriage” or some other moral issue. Christians are becoming frighteningly comfortable with government control over virtually every aspect of life and are coming to equate statism with patriotism. It has taken only 200 short years to squander the liberty that our forefathers paid for in blood!
Politically speaking, a return to Constitutional government is the only temporal hope that we have. As I have pointed out before, revival is the only real hope that we have, and I believe that the latter would bring about the former.
Former Arkansas Governor and Southern Baptist preacher Mike Huckabee has been anointed by the Religious Right as the “God” candidate. He is touted as a conservative in every sense of the word. DON’T BE FOOLED! Huckabee’s record does not match his rhetoric!
Let me give you a few facts.
He does not govern by the Constitution.
Huckabee sought and received the endorsement of the radically leftist National Education Association, and while governor of Arkansas signed into law major restrictions on home schooling. The Arkansas Ethics Commission censured Huckabee 5 times in 14 years for violations including refusing to disclose the identity of donors and using public money for personal uses. When an Arkansas legislator introduced a bill to prevent illegal aliens from voting and receiving state benefits (i.e. welfare), Huckabee denounced the bill as racist and bigoted! In a possible violation of state law, Huckabee bought office space which was sub-let to the Mexican government for $1 per year for a consulate for the purpose of drawing illegal aliens to the state to work low paying jobs.
Huckabee claims to be for fewer taxes, but a report by the Arkansas Department of Finance and Administration showed a net increase of $505 million during his tenure as governor. From 1996 to 2004 state spending increased over 65%, the number of state employees increased over 20%, and the state’s debt increased $1 Billion! Huckabee recently spoke before the globalist Council on Foreign Relations, and subsequently named the president of the CFR Richard Haass as his foreign policy advisor. Haass is an open advocate of global government.
Folks, there is only one way to put it: Huckabee is a liberal!
Thankfully there is a refreshing alternative! That alternative is Ron Paul!
Ron Paul’s political philosophy is that of limited constitutional government and individual freedom and responsibility. Paul has been described as the only true Jeffersonian in Congress. As such, that is why I believe that he deserves the support of Christians in the same way that Jefferson received the support of Baptists 200 years ago.
Ten-term Congressman Ron Paul of Texas is well known by colleagues and constituents as a man of impeccable character. All attempts to smear Ron Paul’s reputation have failed. Ron Paul freely confesses Jesus Christ as his Saviour, but unlike other politicians he doesn’t use that to pander for the evangelical vote. Dr. Paul is an OB/GYN who also served as a Flight Surgeon in the U.S. Air Force and Air National Guard. Dr. Paul has been married to his wife Carol for 50 years. They have five children and 18 grandchildren.
In 20 years in Congress Dr. Paul has:
Never voted to raise taxes.
Never voted for an unbalanced budget.
Never voted to raise congressional pay.
Never taken a government paid junket.
Never taken one penny from a lobbyist!
Never participated in the lucrative congressional pension program.
Consistently returned surplus money from his office operating budget to the treasury.
A Ron Paul Presidency will:
End the IRS and the Income Tax! Stop unconstitutional spending leading us to bankruptcy. Stop the financial dependency on China, Saudi Arabia, and other foreign governments. Oppose trade deals and groups that threaten American independence and sovereignty such as, the UN, NAFTA, WTO, CAFTA, and ICC. Protect individual liberty and constitutional rights by stopping the National ID card and ending the “Patriot” Act. Bring our troops home, and return to the Founder’s philosophy of free trade and avoidance of entangling alliances with foreign governments. Repeal unconstitutional gun control laws.
The issue of abortion is very important to us as Christian voters. Ron Paul is the only consistent pro-life candidate in the race. In over 40 years as an OB/GYN Dr. Paul never considered performing an abortion. He has delivered over 4000 babies, and has testified that he has never seen one instance in which it would be necessary to perform an abortion to save the life of the mother.
In every legislative term, Congressman Paul has introduced legislation to define life as beginning at conception, prevent federal funds from being used for abortion, and to negate the effect of Roe v. Wade in the court. All to no avail, as none of the other “pro-life” congressmen have supported these bills.
Many people ask, “Is Ron Paul a viable candidate?” The answer is: only if you vote for him. Ron Paul has proved his viability in the early primaries by consistently finishing ahead of some who are considered “top-tier” candidates. Paul has set fund-raising records when other candidates were strapped for cash. Interestingly enough, Ron Paul receives more money from active and retired military personnel than any other candidate.
For many years we have bought into the deadly philosophy of voting for the “lesser of two evils.” This philosophy plays on fear. Instead of voting on principle, we hold our nose and vote for someone, in the fear that if we don’t vote for someone who at least as a shot at winning, we might end up with a really bad choice. This has facilitated a consistent move to the left by both parties over the last 40-50 years. We need to stop voting for the lesser of two evils and vote for the greater good of the country.
Do I agree with Ron Paul’s position on every issue? No. Do I believe that a Ron Paul presidency will immediately put America right? No. It will take a lot more than the brief presidency of one man, but we have to start somewhere.
Let’s face it: the reason we are in the mess we are in (politically speaking) is because our Constitution has been absolutely ignored for decades by all three branches of government, regardless of party affiliation.
See, when you look at the record of the two parties you will find very little actual difference. Republicans and Democrats are taking America down the same road, and it is the road to ultimate national destruction. Only a return to strict Constitutional government will avert the complete dissolution of our national sovereignty through globalism. Only a return to strict Constitutionalism in terms of monetary policy and taxation will put our economy and currency back on sound footing. Only a return to strict Constitutionalism will get the Federal Leviathan out of the lives of the American people. Only a return to strict Constitutionalism will de-fang the burgeoning police state. Only a return to strict Constitutionalism will return us to true strength and liberty.
Marty Tate, Pastor
Peaceful Valley Baptist Church
Rising Fawn, Georgia
dmtate@bledsoe.net
A government that is large enough to supply everything you need is large enough to take everything you have - Thomas Jefferson
This post was last modified: Thu Jan 24, 2008 06:51 AM by Mongol Servant.
Daniel 4:17 This matter is by the decree of the watchers, and the demand by the word of the holy ones: to the intent that the living may know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will, and setteth up over it the basest of men.
Daniel 4:25 That they shall drive thee from men, and thy dwelling shall be with the beasts of the field, and they shall make thee to eat grass as oxen, and they shall wet thee with the dew of heaven, and seven times shall pass over thee, till thou know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will.
Daniel 4:32 And they shall drive thee from men, and thy dwelling shall be with the beasts of the field: they shall make thee to eat grass as oxen, and seven times shall pass over thee, until thou know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will.
Daniel 5:18 O thou king, the most high God gave Nebuchadnezzar thy father a kingdom, and majesty, and glory, and honour:
Think again.
David
Job 19:25 But as for me I know that my Redeemer liveth, And at last he will stand up upon the earth:
This post was last modified: Thu Jan 24, 2008 07:33 PM by Davo.
Not exactly, but God has provided citizens in the United States with a representative form of government -- though it becomes less and less so as it moves towards democracy. Anyway, since God has given us a government that allows us a say, there certainly isn't anything wrong with Christians exercising the privilege to vote, right?
Now whether or not there is a candidate worth voting for is another question...
Some time ago my family viseted
Marty Tate, Pastor
Peaceful Valley Baptist Church
Rising Fawn, Georgia
They are @ 50-60 miles from us
Good meeting
Good people
Good food (they fed us lunch)
Most of all They serve a GREAT GOD!!
I also take the same stand the Pastor NEEDS to tell the people who the BIBLE says to vote for we name (or should) other SINS but not voting wrong
Most pastors stoped doing this in 1954 (lbj and the 501c3 thing)
1963 Bible and Prayer was out of schools (still we will save the world with 5 oh no whait 3year olds)
1973 BABY killing is legal
And it has gone down hill fast sence then
Are YOU or your pastor afread to stand for right and tell your Church to vote for
RON PAUL this year
I AM NOT.
We even say to vote for Ron Paul out front on our sign!
Pastor Harold Jordan
Ebenezer free Church
120 Ridgeview Ln
Birchwood TN http://www.elijahbc.com
My Bible says that the church age is going to end in apostasy - that isn't talking about the cults, either - that's talking about those who know the truth, are going to turn from it. It's been posted before, but I'll write it up one more time for emphasis - back in the 50's, our Baptist President Harry S. Truman, decided that he would send an ambassador to the Vatican. The BAPTISTS (no one else) raised such a fuss about it, that Truman dropped it like a hot rock! In 1980, conservative-backed Ronald Wilson Reagan, not only proposed to send an ambassador to the Vatican - HE DID IT - and the Baptists in this country DIDN'T EVEN PEEP! Ever wonder why no one in this administration (and most of the Congress) hasn't done their constitutional duty to secure our borders? Because they have been given ORDERS by the Vatican, NOT TO - 98% of those illegal border jumpers are ROMAN CATHOLIC! It is a widely known fact that the Roman catholic church hates the King James Bible, they hate our constitutional form of government, and they hate our country.
Now, what has changed in the last 60-70 years? Most Baptists are in this "bunker mentality" - i.e. "I'm just waiting for the rapture!" They have fell head-long into full-blown apostasy. As Jesse Helms told me one time, "Most conservative Americans and Christians, have been reduced to the level of having to vote for the lesser of two evils. Isn't that still EVIL?" What a Statesman. But you watch the upcoming election: the Baptists will follow the standard news-mafia pitch, just like lemmings, and vote for whoever the mafia says is the most conservative. We have a candidate that is a Christian and has consistently followed the mandate of the U.S. Constitution, as he took an oath to do. He has so many good qualities, and yet the news mafia HATES HIM. Rupert Murdoch, who owns ALL the major news outlets, had a meeting a few months back, and told his staffers, that defeating Ron Paul was the highest priority for his entire organization. You're right - this may be our last chance to stand up and be counted, in an election that will determine the future of our country for a very long time.
A government that is large enough to supply everything you need is large enough to take everything you have - Thomas Jefferson
This post was last modified: Tue Jan 29, 2008 01:24 AM by Mongol Servant.
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