Is the cambellite church a cult? They do not appear to hold to the N.T. doctrines of Faith, Baptism, and Eternal security.

Greg Larimore
Jamestown, NC

They most assuredly are.

In Christ,
George

Greg,
They are indeed a cult.

They are the type of people that the apostle paul talked about in Galatians 1:7 "Perverting the gospel of Christ"
They do this by offering works as a means of gaining salvation which we are told in Ephesians 2:8-9 That it isn't by works!
The main points of error in the cambellite church formed around 1830 is this:
They preach water regeneration ....They say without baptism you cannot be saved! What about the theif on the cross? What about those saints in Acts 10: 43-48, Acts 15:1-11, They were all saved by faith! Look at Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.

By doing this they are taking away from the means of atonement in which God said would have to be.
Hebrews 9:22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
It's never been the water, it is still the BLOOD!
They are wrong on baptism Romans 6:3-6 Colossians 2:12-13.
They love to quote Mark 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.The only problem is they miss the mark of "BELIEVETH" You do not go to Hell for not being baptized, You go because you do not believe!
I John 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world; and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

Romans 10:13 FOR WHOSOEVER SHALL CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD SHALL BE SAVED.
They are also wrong on eternal security!
How long is eternity? everlasting? Not long to a cambellite.
Romans 6:23 John 6:47 I John 2:25 John 3:15-16 John 10:28-30
Jesus only gives out one type of salvation "Eternal" John 17:1-3
They do not believe in the healing power of God today Ref James 5:13-16 They say that is all past! Jesus is the same Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

This is a few of the errors of doctrine in which the Cambellite church which was started by Barton W Stone, and Thomas Campbell just after 1830 They call themselves the Church of Christ from Romans 16:16, but the disciples called themselves THE CHURCH OF GOD, The Saints, Brethren, The Church, in Acts 11:26 they were called Christians. What do all those names have in common, They are used in the scripture to describe the true Church, Not the cambellite church.

Greg i hope this has been helpful, remember the Lord said his church would not end ( Matthew 16:18 ) So if they say they are the true church, they would follow the Lord's commands, and scriptural truth. Where was the church for 1800 years? The cambellite movement started in the 1830's so where was the true church, Right where it is today with many different members but all one body!
If you folow their baptism for salvation, you will end up being baptized in the lake of fire!
They reject GRACE, They Reject FAITH, They reject ETERNAL SECURITY, sounds like false teachers! Sounds like false doctrine.

They also do not allow any instruments of music in their services, Funny how David under the law could play instruments and praise the Lord, but they cannot under grace..Read Ephesians 5:19 Is not psalms listed their? Every Jew knows that they played music with the Psalms.

Who is the church?......All the Saints who are Born Again John3:

Thank the Lord all the saints from every church are part of the body of Christ, if they have been converted.

Converted, not confused!

Jim Norman
Northside Baptist Church

This post was last modified: Wed Oct 31, 2007 09:01 AM by NCUNIT33.

Found this link...Thank you !

http://www.biblebelievers.com/david_mart...hrist.html

Greg

You can find a conversation with one of these waterdogs at
http://p067.ezboard.com/fthetruth11187fr...=1&stop=25

[/b]"But this I confess to you, that according to the Way which they call a sect, so I worship the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written . . ."

Paul was a member of what was considered to be a cult, so members of the church of Christ don't take offense to this assertion. I was recently baptized into Jesus' church after a careful study of the Bible revealed that the Baptist church (and all others) don't preach the gospel that Paul preached, but instead have to take every passage in the Bible and twist it to conform to their own standards.

The church of Christ was restored in England and in the U.S. by Baptist and Methodist ministers who recognized that the dogmas of the Reformation were unscriptural. Jesus said that the gates of hell would not prevail against His church, and I feel very confident that He is to be held to His word.

God told Adam not to eat the fruit or he would die. Satan came along, added one little word "not" and caused Adam and Eve to die spiritually and later physically. The same has been done with baptism. Satan would like nothing more than to have company and his plan has worked to his advantage. Think about this . . . if baptism wasn't necessary, it wouldn't condemn you to be baptized. But if it is necessary (which it is), then not being baptized will condemn you. Which does Satan get more mileage out of?

I pray that you open your Bibles, learn a little Greek, and accept that even in English, it is clear that baptism is the point at which you are saved. I Peter 3:21 clearly says that baptism saves us, at least until one of Satan's angels twists it up for you. My advice is not to ask, just read it for what it says. The word often rendered 'belief' actually means obedience. See John 3:36. The first 'believe' is 'pisteuo' which is mental. The second 'believe' is a different Greek word, 'apeitheo' which means not mental belief, but 'obey'. The same applies in Acts. There is an article at http://www.christiancourier.com. Just type these Greek words into the search bar.

Romans 6:17, "But God be thanked that though you were slaves of sin, yet you obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine to which you were delivered. And having been set free from sin, you became slaves of righteousness."

We see here that we were slaves, we obeyed something, and not until after that obedience were we righteous. The "doctrine to which you were delivered" is defined in 1 Corinthians 15:3,4, and is the message of the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ. The "form" that was to be obeyed is a "likeness" or something that "looks like" the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ. This is clearly defined for us in Colossians 2:12:

" . . . buried with Him in baptism, in which you were also raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead."

So, in short, we are slaves of sin, and after baptism (and only after) are we found righteous. If you were not baptized for this purpose, then I urge you to do so, as the disciples of Acts 19:1-7 had to be baptized correctly after receiving the incorrect baptism. Please also note from these passages, that they were asked if they received the Holy Spirit when they "believed." They weren't asked if they believed and were not led in a sinner's prayer (which is nowhere authorized or practiced in the Bible) but were baptized immediately--again.

You might be interested to know that belief is a "work" according to John 6:29. Belief is a "work of God." Refer back to Colossians 2:12 and note that baptism is also a "work of God." We either have to accept both or reject both. By rejecting baptism as a mere work of man, then you must reject believe as a requirement for salvation as well.

There is nothing special about the water, and the church of Christ does not teach such because the Bible (our only creed) does not teach such. It is obedience from the heart. Disobedient people do not believe (Hebrews 3:18-19), and that is the core of why they are lost.

We don't know if the thief was baptized (Mark 1:5). Jesus had power to forgive sins while He was on earth (Mark 2:10, Matt 9:6, Luke 5:24) but after He died, His will had to be carried out according to the terms He specified (Hebrews 9:16). His will included baptism (Luke 7:29-30), and though many call Him 'Lord,' only he who does His will enters the kingdom (Matthew 7:21).

The Bible does it teach unconditional eternal security. Denominational preachers do, but the Bible is very clear that eternal salvation is contingent upon faithfulness (Rev 2:10, Hebrews 6:4)).

It is also very clear that identifying with anyone other than Christ, as the Baptists, Methodists, Wesleyans, Lutherans, etc. do is condemned (I Cor 1:12). We are not Campbellites . . . the only ones who insist on calling us such are the people who identify themselves with man-made, unscriptural names. We are Christians and only that. We give Christ the preeminence through the name of His church (Romans 16:16, Matt 28:18, Col 1:1. Any true Christian will do the same.

It was very hard for me to leave the Baptist church. I truly believe that the people there believe they are doing God's will and are very kind and very sincere. These things do not save us. The truth saves us (II Thess 2:9-11). It is impossible for any one man to know the entirety of God's plan, but He gave us the Scriptures so that we might know enough of it. We must be born again, which is to be born of water and the spirit (John 3:5). Regardless of what denominational preachers tell you, the water is baptism.

Baptism, including John's (Mark 1:4), was to receive the remission of sins. In Acts 2:38, we are not baptized because we have already received forgiveness, but to receive forgiveness (cf. Acts 22:16). The word rendered 'for' is 'eis'. The entire phrase is 'eis aphesin hamartion' and means 'so that you will receive forgiveness of sins'. The exact same phrase in Greek and English is used in Matthew 26:28. Was Jesus' blood shed because we were already forgiven? We all know it was not.

Calling on the name of the Lord is not verbal confession. It is baptism (Acts 22:16).

We are saved by the blood of Jesus (Romans 5:9). The waters of baptism are where we come into contact with that blood (1 John 5:.

There is a very thorough study of baptism at http://www.bebaptized.org. There is a free, printable booklet that you can read, study, and share with others if you feel led to.

Each of the four Gospels records a different version of what was on the sign of Jesus' cross. We must either conclude that they are all wrong or they are all right. By putting them together, we learn exactly what the sign said in its entirety. Each of the gospels records part of it, and by joining them together, we get the entire picture. It is the same with God's plan for salvation. We must take everything He said through the Spirit in the scriptures, join them together, and see the clear picture of His intentions for us.

I pray that you have learned something from this and that you will humble yourself enough to refrain from bashing Christians and seek the truth that you might be saved yourselves. If you have not been baptized to be saved, then you have only gotten wet. Eternity is too long to be proud on this earth. It is not about being right or wrong in our own eyes. This is a salvation issue and many millions of people have already been lost because of this vicious lie.

There is no record of musical instruments in worship until the Catholic church brought them in, around 666 A.D. Even the reformers did not accept musical instruments in worship. That should make an interesting study for you. God never commanded us to use musical instruments, but he did condemn those who worshiped Him in an unauthorized manner (Lev 10:1-7). David did lots of things that you wouldn't dream of doing today, including multiple wives, animal sacrifices, dancing in worship, etc. Just because God didn't say not to doesn't give us authority to do it. That's what it is all about . . . letting God dictate how we worship Him. Anything else is will-worship and a doctrine of man.

If you ordered a pizza with pepperoni, and the guy delivered pepperoni, mushrooms, onions, and peppers, would you be upset? Of course! Now, you didn't tell him NOT to put those extra things on your pizza. Your lack of requesting them was a silent command to do nothing but put pepperoni on your pizza.

You can also do a search to see the answers to these questions. Many Christians have been willing to take the challenge.

We are very well aware of the Church of Christs' doctrine, and it is nothing short of heresy. Any doctrine is heretical if one adds works to salvation. It is plain and simple. Physical baptism is NOT a requirement of salvation. If you understood biblical context, you would know that. The baptism referred to in the NT, anywhere your denomination points out, refers to a spiritual baptism into Jesus Christ, as represented by His vicarious atonement on the cross, and into death. And yes, we believe in the resurrection, do you?

If you want to know about Greek, then just go ask GreekTim, he is about as close as to what I would call our resident Greek expert.

We love you, and will try to show you truth also, becase we love you. I am sorry you feel that the truth is "bashing" someone.

Love in Christ,

Jim

We are also well aware of the lack of music in your house. I attended many a CoC service, but have as of yet seen anyone give any proof that musical instruments are condemned in worship. Basing doctrine on silence in scripture is just as dangerous as being Pharasaical and adding something.

I would dearly LOVE to see the basis for this claim.

Oh, and by the way, there are Baptists, Reformists, Presbyterians, and other denominations here. So I am quite at a loss as to why you pointed out Baptists in particular.

As C.H. Spurgeon once said 'I wish to not be known by any other name than that of "Christian"'

One last thought,

I am quite at a loss as how you can blame us for bashing, when the very first post you commit is doing the exact same thing you accuse us of, that is hypocrisy. I also am willing to bet (if I were a betting man, which I am not), that you did not read our statement of faith before posting. If you HAD, you would realize that your doctrine, we would not agree with.

As for baptism, it has already been shown by scripture that it is wrong as a requirement
for salvation:

Mark 16:16
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

"He that believeth" - This is a affirmative action in ones mind that Jesus Christ is who He says He is, "The Son of God" He who is come to save that which was lost, Jesus the Christ, the only begotten Son of God.

"And is baptized". Visualize for one moment what exactly is going on here. Is it enough to believe? No, we are already told that the devils believe and tremble (Jas 2:19). Now the physical act of baptism represents what? The death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. There is no other meaning to it. Now, for us to say that a literal, submersion of water of our bodies is a requirement of salvation is NO different than the catholic church telling us that the eucharist is truly the body and blood of Jesus Christ. According to CoC philosophy, we are to take all things logically and literally, not contextually. As the last supper or communion of remembrance is symbolic of Jesus' broken body and shed blood, so also is baptism symbolic of His death, burial, and resurrection.

"he that believeth not shall be damned" - Very simple, baptism, sin, etc apart, simply not believing on His name carries the penalty of eternal damnation. It does not say, "He that believes, but is not baptised, shall be damned"

Baptism, immersion in water, is symbolic, and is a commandment from God, and as Christians, we should desire to do this, and obey the Lord, but an actual requirement for salvation? Mistake.


As for the music aspect of the CoC:

It is difficult to rationalize the Lord God saying, "Well, for 4000 years I enjoyed the praise and worship of my people with the stringed instruments, harps, horns, and timbrels, but you know what? I am now bored of that and decide that I no longer want any instruments
to accompany the voices of praise and worship." (yes, this is tongue in cheek, forgive me Lord). I mean come on! Let's bring out the common sense God gave us.

Speaking of hypocrisy though. I attended a retreat with a friend of mine who attended the CoC, and I decided why not go? We went to Gatlinburg, TN where there were over 2000 teens from CoC's across the nation. And do you want to guess what we did that Friday night? You guessed it! We went to a ROCK concert to see AVB(Acappella Vocal Band) live. It was amazing to watch hundreds of teenagers swaying to the almost beat-like quality of the tempo of their voices, girls screaming with exctasy at the young men singing. And yes, they DID in fact use massive thousands of watts amplifiers and speakers to amplify their voices.

So it's ok to use all kinds of amplification devices and electronics and hold concerts to screaming teenagers, but it is not ok to blow a trumpet for the Lord. Amazing indeed.....hypocrisy knows no bounds....

KMD,
You R wrong on this one here.
Just read Psalms 150.
This little chapter alone shows you to be more wrong than wrong can possibly be.

Say what? Please finish the sentence......tick,tick..tick..

Useless verbage.

You lie again... ho hum....God did command in his word to use musical instruments. So read it again, since you stated unbelief again.

So as a people we grow, but the lessons are the same and just as valid.

That is simply denominational doctrine and not Bible.

Just because he says we can, does not mean that we always are allowed to do it. ... The other side of the coin...

*******
Well, after following your man made thoughts, it is obvious that you don't read the Holy Bible for God's glory; PLUS you do not put things in proper context...nor do you apply useful words to promote truth....but instead promote vapours of man's wisdom in the place of God.

Not at all, in fact.
I would feel blessed to receive more than I asked for,because I am content where I am, already.

Not completely true.
Many times, people do more than is expected and many are wondered at them and appreciative of what has happened.
So much so, that they are glad of what has happened, and not upset whatsoever.

PeterAV
Every word of God is pure.

This post was last modified: Tue Apr 08, 2008 04:28 AM by PeterAV.

That therein lies the problem itself, Jim . . . water baptism is not a work of man. It is very clearly stated in Col 2:12. The baptism of the New Testament is the one that Jesus Christ clearly commanded in the great commission. He said, "GO and make disciples of of all the nations, baptizing them . . ." How can an apostle baptize a man in the spirit? He can't. He doesn't. God does that. Water baptism is a very clear command. It is God at work in baptism, as He is the one who has the dirty job of washing away one's spiritual filth.

There is no scriptural reason whatsoever to believe that any baptism in the Bible is spirit baptism. The only spirit baptisms occurred at Pentecost to begin the church, and years later on Cornelius's household. Cornelius family received the baptism of the spirit while Peter was still speaking . . . they had not yet even believed what he was saying! One can't misconstrue that to say they were "saved" before water baptism. Then, to top it off, Peter "commanded" that they be baptized in water as there was no one who could "forbid water" (Acts 10:47) and Peter was under no authority to "withstand God" (Acts 11:17). The spirit baptism of Cornelius was to be a sign to the Jews that salvation was available to the Gentiles only (Acts 11:9).

Peter noted that Cornelius's family had received the baptism of spirit just as the apostles had "at the beginning" (Acts 11:17). There was a lapse of several years in between Pentecost and the conversion of Cornelius's household, and if the spirit baptism was a routine occurrence, there would have been thousands of examples that Peter could have pointed to rather than have to go all the way back to Pentecost. The baptism of the spirit was always accompanied by speaking in tongues. The gifts of tongues were otherwise administered through the laying on of an apostles hands (Acts 8:15-17, 19:6).

The baptism of I Peter 3:21 is very clearly water . . . Noah was saved through water and baptism is an antitype of that. There is no mention of Spirit, and there is no passage in the New Testament that indicates that the baptisms administered were anything other than in water.

Furthermore, the only ones to receive that baptism at Pentecost were the 12. It was promised only to them (Acts 1:4), was on a different day from the meeting in the upper room which took place on the Sabbath (Acts 1:12, Acts 2:1), which would not have been big enough to hold the thousands of Jews who had traveled to Jerusalem for Pentecost and witnessed the event. The ones who spoke in tongues were "Galileans" only (i.e., the apostles, Acts 1:11) whereas the 120 disciples contained Judeans (e.g., Mary, Martha, and Lazarus).

Jim, you replied so quickly and at such a strange time that it doesn't seem that you even gave my prior post much thought. You seem very threatened by the whole idea of water baptism. I do not ask men (even those who claim to be fluent in Greek like Tim) for their opinions on the Bible, as I am very capable of doing it myself as is anyone who really wants to study it. The only reason that anyone would ever think that the baptism in the N.T. is one of spirit is one who had been told that. Such is not evident from reading the Bible.

The church of Christ is not heretical and those of us who do not despise clear commands are not threatened by people who love the commandments of men. Even the fallible men who 'reformed' the church understood that baptism was necessary. They also understood that mechanical instruments were not to be used during worship. My guess is that you have never studied into that, but materials pertaining to such are readily available.

Have a nice day, Jim.